Stimulus Package

Rate this topic
Post anything NOT related to football here.
User avatar
UplandRam
Site Admin
Posts: 1442
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2015 6:19 am
Location: Glendora, CA
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 9:41 am

Apparently we have learned absolutely nothing from the endless bailouts. This morning, the jobless numbers should be sending the stock market into a deep dive. They aren't, and the reason is simple. Wall Street is once again being artificially pumped up with trillions from the fed as a part of this stimulus package. This stimulus package claims 2 trillion for relief to American businesses and individuals. Another 4 TRILLION will be passed on to Wall Street so major corporations can continue to engage in stock buybacks, thereby artificially inflating their stock value. Additionally, these tax payer funded buybacks shrink the number outstanding shares further artificially increasing the value of the stock. Traders on wall street love it because they get commissions by the millions to 'manage" this entire process. Furthermore, there is going to enormous insider trading USING OUR MONEY.

I am a conservative by nature. I strongly believe in free markets. But, what we are seeing isn't free markets, quite the contrary, we are seeing total manipulation of the markets by the top 10% of corporations who happen to have close ties to Washington. For most of us, we will never know just how corrupt this entire system has become. For the average small business owner, this stimulus package will do very little. To get the financial relief needed, there will be TONS of paperwork, a bureaucratic nightmare.... while those on Wall Street will simply make a phone call.

Once again, the top 10% who control 85% of the stock market are using another crisis to enrich themselves and politicians from both parties are eager to help. In return, these politicians who have deep ties to the market movers will continue to reap millions in 'donations' and actionable inside information.



User avatar
Dick84
Hall of Famer
Posts: 12605
Joined: Tue May 12, 2015 6:13 pm
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:27 am

Totally fair.
I think the "both sides" is a little exaggerated.. but that's my take.

There's stuff in this relief bill that has nothing to do with the coronavirus situation, when it comes to Wall Street and big business.

But Lindsey Graham thinks Americans are going to get too much money on unemployment. lol


Okay, okay, okay.... I'll stop being a dick.
3-24-16

Rammer
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2653
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 12:17 pm
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:56 am

UplandRam wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 9:41 am
Apparently we have learned absolutely nothing from the endless bailouts. This morning, the jobless numbers should be sending the stock market into a deep dive. They aren't, and the reason is simple. Wall Street is once again being artificially pumped up with trillions from the fed as a part of this stimulus package. This stimulus package claims 2 trillion for relief to American businesses and individuals. Another 4 TRILLION will be passed on to Wall Street so major corporations can continue to engage in stock buybacks, thereby artificially inflating their stock value. Additionally, these tax payer funded buybacks shrink the number outstanding shares further artificially increasing the value of the stock. Traders on wall street love it because they get commissions by the millions to 'manage" this entire process. Furthermore, there is going to enormous insider trading USING OUR MONEY.

I am a conservative by nature. I strongly believe in free markets. But, what we are seeing isn't free markets, quite the contrary, we are seeing total manipulation of the markets by the top 10% of corporations who happen to have close ties to Washington. For most of us, we will never know just how corrupt this entire system has become. For the average small business owner, this stimulus package will do very little. To get the financial relief needed, there will be TONS of paperwork, a bureaucratic nightmare.... while those on Wall Street will simply make a phone call.

Once again, the top 10% who control 85% of the stock market are using another crisis to enrich themselves and politicians from both parties are eager to help. In return, these politicians who have deep ties to the market movers will continue to reap millions in 'donations' and actionable inside information.

i'm with you, the deal sucks especially if there isn't a provision to prevent corporate buy backs. I keep hearing Trump say that this was a stipulation. Did it not make it to the final deal? I do think, though, that free market argument doesn't apply here. The govt is the one interfering in the free market. They are telling people to stay home, telling many companies to shut down. That isn't a free market.



ocram23
Veteran
Posts: 1673
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2019 6:12 pm
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:00 am

Dick84 wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:27 am
Totally fair.
I think the "both sides" is a little exaggerated.. but that's my take.

There's stuff in this relief bill that has nothing to do with the coronavirus situation, when it comes to Wall Street and big business.

But Lindsey Graham thinks Americans are going to get too much money on unemployment. lol
[/quot

James Clyburn's quote, " the crisis is also “a tremendous opportunity to restructure things to fit our vision.” we can go back and forth on this Dick. You are like a broken record with this bipartisan shit.



User avatar
Dick84
Hall of Famer
Posts: 12605
Joined: Tue May 12, 2015 6:13 pm
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:02 am

ocram23 wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:00 am
Dick84 wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:27 am
Totally fair.
I think the "both sides" is a little exaggerated.. but that's my take.

There's stuff in this relief bill that has nothing to do with the coronavirus situation, when it comes to Wall Street and big business.

But Lindsey Graham thinks Americans are going to get too much money on unemployment. lol
[/quot

James Clyburn's quote, " the crisis is also “a tremendous opportunity to restructure things to fit our vision.” we can go back and forth on this Dick. You are like a broken record with this bipartisan shit.
Shrug.
It’s Graham’s words. You figure it out.


Okay, okay, okay.... I'll stop being a dick.
3-24-16

ocram23
Veteran
Posts: 1673
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2019 6:12 pm
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:05 am

Dick84 wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:02 am
ocram23 wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:00 am
Dick84 wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:27 am
Totally fair.
I think the "both sides" is a little exaggerated.. but that's my take.

There's stuff in this relief bill that has nothing to do with the coronavirus situation, when it comes to Wall Street and big business.

But Lindsey Graham thinks Americans are going to get too much money on unemployment. lol
[/quot

James Clyburn's quote, " the crisis is also “a tremendous opportunity to restructure things to fit our vision.” we can go back and forth on this Dick. You are like a broken record with this bipartisan shit.
Shrug.
It’s Graham’s words. You figure it out.
part of the unemployment package in the beginning was going to give people more money than if they were working full time so yes that is a problem.



User avatar
RamPower
Veteran
Posts: 2030
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:52 pm
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:06 am

UplandRam wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 9:41 am
Apparently we have learned absolutely nothing from the endless bailouts. This morning, the jobless numbers should be sending the stock market into a deep dive. They aren't, and the reason is simple. Wall Street is once again being artificially pumped up with trillions from the fed as a part of this stimulus package. This stimulus package claims 2 trillion for relief to American businesses and individuals. Another 4 TRILLION will be passed on to Wall Street so major corporations can continue to engage in stock buybacks, thereby artificially inflating their stock value. Additionally, these tax payer funded buybacks shrink the number outstanding shares further artificially increasing the value of the stock. Traders on wall street love it because they get commissions by the millions to 'manage" this entire process. Furthermore, there is going to enormous insider trading USING OUR MONEY.

I am a conservative by nature. I strongly believe in free markets. But, what we are seeing isn't free markets, quite the contrary, we are seeing total manipulation of the markets by the top 10% of corporations who happen to have close ties to Washington. For most of us, we will never know just how corrupt this entire system has become. For the average small business owner, this stimulus package will do very little. To get the financial relief needed, there will be TONS of paperwork, a bureaucratic nightmare.... while those on Wall Street will simply make a phone call.

Once again, the top 10% who control 85% of the stock market are using another crisis to enrich themselves and politicians from both parties are eager to help. In return, these politicians who have deep ties to the market movers will continue to reap millions in 'donations' and actionable inside information.
Agree.



User avatar
UplandRam
Site Admin
Posts: 1442
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2015 6:19 am
Location: Glendora, CA
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:31 am

Dick84 wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:27 am
Totally fair.
I think the "both sides" is a little exaggerated.. but that's my take.

There's stuff in this relief bill that has nothing to do with the coronavirus situation, when it comes to Wall Street and big business.

But Lindsey Graham thinks Americans are going to get too much money on unemployment. lol
The "both sides" is absolutely true. Do you seriously think Joe Biden and his family haven't profited from his position? Do you think Feinstein’s husband, Richard C. Blum, secured the contract to sell off Post Office facilities by his firms own efforts? Do you seriously think the donations to the Clinton Foundation from foreign governments and defense contractors had nothing to do with the arms deals she approved while SOS? Have you ever looked into the special loans given to members of congress and their staffers by Countrywide just prior to the 2008 mortgage meltdown?

The corruption runs DEEP into both parties, if you think otherwise, you are fooling yourself.

Also, Rammer is 100% correct. The federal government has NO constitutional authority whatsoever in forcing private companies who are legally operating to close.
"The fulfillment of these totalitarian impulses has put more than 1 million folks out of work, closed thousands of businesses and impaired the fundamental rights of tens of millions of persons – all in violation of numerous sections of the Constitution.

The Contracts Clause of the Constitution prohibits the states from interfering with lawful contracts, such as leases and employment agreements.

And the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment prohibits the states from interfering with life, liberty or property without a trial at which the state must prove fault.

The Takings Clause of the Fifth Amendment requires just compensation when the state meaningfully interferes with an owner’s chosen lawful use of his property.

Taken together, these clauses reveal the significant protections of private property in the Constitution itself. Add to this the threat of punishment that has accompanied these decrees and the fact that they are executive decrees, not legislation, and one can see the paramount rejection of basic democratic and constitutional principles in the minds and words and deeds of those who have perpetrated them.

Add to all this, the protection in the First Amendment of the right to associate and the judicially recognized right to travel – both of which are natural rights – and it is clear that these nanny state rules are unconstitutional, unlawful and unworthy of respect or compliance"



ocram23
Veteran
Posts: 1673
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2019 6:12 pm
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:36 am

UplandRam wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:31 am
Dick84 wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:27 am
Totally fair.
I think the "both sides" is a little exaggerated.. but that's my take.

There's stuff in this relief bill that has nothing to do with the coronavirus situation, when it comes to Wall Street and big business.

But Lindsey Graham thinks Americans are going to get too much money on unemployment. lol
The "both sides" is absolutely true. Do you seriously think Joe Biden and his family haven't profited from his position? Do you think Feinstein’s husband, Richard C. Blum, secured the contract to sell off Post Office facilities by his firms own efforts? Do you seriously think the donations to the Clinton Foundation from foreign governments and defense contractors had nothing to do with the arms deals she approved while SOS? Have you ever looked into the special loans given to members of congress and their staffers by Countrywide just prior to the 2008 mortgage meltdown?

The corruption runs DEEP into both parties, if you think otherwise, you are fooling yourself.
dick's road only goes one way. he is blinded by actual facts. Pelosi and Feinstein are 2 of the biggest crooks in the state of CA. I have no problem calling out Trump and the republican politicians when they error.



User avatar
Dick84
Hall of Famer
Posts: 12605
Joined: Tue May 12, 2015 6:13 pm
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:51 am

UplandRam wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:31 am
Dick84 wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:27 am
Totally fair.
I think the "both sides" is a little exaggerated.. but that's my take.

There's stuff in this relief bill that has nothing to do with the coronavirus situation, when it comes to Wall Street and big business.

But Lindsey Graham thinks Americans are going to get too much money on unemployment. lol
The "both sides" is absolutely true. Do you seriously think Joe Biden and his family haven't profited from his position? Do you think Feinstein’s husband, Richard C. Blum, secured the contract to sell off Post Office facilities by his firms own efforts? Do you seriously think the donations to the Clinton Foundation from foreign governments and defense contractors had nothing to do with the arms deals she approved while SOS? Have you ever looked into the special loans given to members of congress and their staffers by Countrywide just prior to the 2008 mortgage meltdown?

The corruption runs DEEP into both parties, if you think otherwise, you are fooling yourself.

Also, Rammer is 100% correct. The federal government has NO constitutional authority whatsoever in forcing private companies who are legally operating to close.
"The fulfillment of these totalitarian impulses has put more than 1 million folks out of work, closed thousands of businesses and impaired the fundamental rights of tens of millions of persons – all in violation of numerous sections of the Constitution.

The Contracts Clause of the Constitution prohibits the states from interfering with lawful contracts, such as leases and employment agreements.

And the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment prohibits the states from interfering with life, liberty or property without a trial at which the state must prove fault.

The Takings Clause of the Fifth Amendment requires just compensation when the state meaningfully interferes with an owner’s chosen lawful use of his property.

Taken together, these clauses reveal the significant protections of private property in the Constitution itself. Add to this the threat of punishment that has accompanied these decrees and the fact that they are executive decrees, not legislation, and one can see the paramount rejection of basic democratic and constitutional principles in the minds and words and deeds of those who have perpetrated them.

Add to all this, the protection in the First Amendment of the right to associate and the judicially recognized right to travel – both of which are natural rights – and it is clear that these nanny state rules are unconstitutional, unlawful and unworthy of respect or compliance"
Again... the degree of “both sides”.

Not going into the rest.


Okay, okay, okay.... I'll stop being a dick.
3-24-16

User avatar
UplandRam
Site Admin
Posts: 1442
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2015 6:19 am
Location: Glendora, CA
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 12:09 pm

To touch on this a little further. What is most upsetting to me is that the Federal Government should have had a comprehensive plan in place to deal with such a crisis. After all, experts have been warning about just such an event for decades. Instead, during the last few years, democratic members of congress and spent their efforts trying as hard as possible to obstruct and or remove a constitutionally elected President.

As I think I mentioned before, I have a sister who worked as a mid-level manager for the Federal Government in Washington DC. She held this position for 35 years. She told me nothing gets done on the legislative or regulatory level unless you are willing to make deals OUTSIDE the process. Which means; kickbacks. In total disgust, she retired and was thinking about writing a book; basically as a whistleblower. She put that idea aside after she was told "her pension would be at risk".

This is the reality of DC.




User avatar
ElAcky
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2691
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2018 12:49 pm
Contact:

Thu Mar 26, 2020 1:04 pm

You are now a socialist country



User avatar
UplandRam
Site Admin
Posts: 1442
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2015 6:19 am
Location: Glendora, CA
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 12:23 am

Yes, and we have assholes like this guy who profits from death:https://www.foxnews.com/media/tucker-ca ... oronavirus



Rammer
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2653
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 12:17 pm
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 6:40 am

ElAcky wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 1:04 pm
You are now a socialist country
This is why you keep government as small as possible.



User avatar
ElAcky
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2691
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2018 12:49 pm
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 6:46 am

Rammer wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 6:40 am
ElAcky wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 1:04 pm
You are now a socialist country
This is why you keep government as small as possible.
I didn't realise that 3.3M registered unemployed was the highest in one month since 1980..

Here is the reason why (pardon CNN as it came up on my news aggregator but see video)..

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/27/poli ... index.html

This is why socialism (or a form of) is a must.



User avatar
ElAcky
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2691
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2018 12:49 pm
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 6:49 am

Really glad Dems blocked bailout of Big Oil & Trump hotels....

After this comes the Green New Deal... infrastructure baby !!! to get jobs rolling.



Rammer
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2653
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 12:17 pm
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:14 am

ElAcky wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 6:49 am
Really glad Dems blocked bailout of Big Oil & Trump hotels....

After this comes the Green New Deal... infrastructure baby !!! to get jobs rolling.
Keep dreaming......

I do agree with you that we already have socialism here to a large degree.

How did America get by during the Spanish Flu of 1917/1918 without a 2 trillion dollar stimulus? Some how we did or they did and by 1920 the economy was roaring.
Why now is it one week out of work and everyone needs a random $1200 check sent to them or they will go bankrupt? Too many Americans are too dependent on government to solve all of their problems. We need govt. here and we need stimulus. But seriously?. I'm good with better unemployment benefits and some kind of extension of health care benefits for out of work people and some targeted relief to save the economy from collapse. But come on, this spending is ridiculous.

Personally, I sold a good percentage of my equities much earlier on and then some more on the recent bumps - I'll get back in when I see companies hiring again.



User avatar
ElAcky
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2691
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2018 12:49 pm
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:57 am

Rammer wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:14 am
ElAcky wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 6:49 am
Really glad Dems blocked bailout of Big Oil & Trump hotels....

After this comes the Green New Deal... infrastructure baby !!! to get jobs rolling.
Keep dreaming......

I do agree with you that we already have socialism here to a large degree.

How did America get by during the Spanish Flu of 1917/1918 without a 2 trillion dollar stimulus? Some how we did or they did and by 1920 the economy was roaring.
Why now is it one week out of work and everyone needs a random $1200 check sent to them or they will go bankrupt? Too many Americans are too dependent on government to solve all of their problems. We need govt. here and we need stimulus. But seriously?. I'm good with better unemployment benefits and some kind of extension of health care benefits for out of work people and some targeted relief to save the economy from collapse. But come on, this spending is ridiculous.

Personally, I sold a good percentage of my equities much earlier on and then some more on the recent bumps - I'll get back in when I see companies hiring again.
There is plenty of money to go around... just happens to be in the hands of the greedy 10 to 20 people.

The rest of us are living close to the edge and a soon as there is a down turn we are in trouble. This is fundamentally wrong.

Every time something like this happens there is a fundamental change in behaviour and the role of Government. During and after the war was a great example.

The Green New Deal or whatever repackaged word Trump decides to call it will happen... its inevitable, it will create loads of jobs and give the economy a chance to reboot.



User avatar
Rampager66
Hall of Famer
Posts: 6845
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:46 pm
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:19 am

ElAcky wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:57 am
Rammer wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:14 am
ElAcky wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 6:49 am
Really glad Dems blocked bailout of Big Oil & Trump hotels....

After this comes the Green New Deal... infrastructure baby !!! to get jobs rolling.
Keep dreaming......

I do agree with you that we already have socialism here to a large degree.

How did America get by during the Spanish Flu of 1917/1918 without a 2 trillion dollar stimulus? Some how we did or they did and by 1920 the economy was roaring.
Why now is it one week out of work and everyone needs a random $1200 check sent to them or they will go bankrupt? Too many Americans are too dependent on government to solve all of their problems. We need govt. here and we need stimulus. But seriously?. I'm good with better unemployment benefits and some kind of extension of health care benefits for out of work people and some targeted relief to save the economy from collapse. But come on, this spending is ridiculous.

Personally, I sold a good percentage of my equities much earlier on and then some more on the recent bumps - I'll get back in when I see companies hiring again.
There is plenty of money to go around... just happens to be in the hands of the greedy 10 to 20 people.

The rest of us are living close to the edge and a soon as there is a down turn we are in trouble. This is fundamentally wrong.

Every time something like this happens there is a fundamental change in behaviour and the role of Government. During and after the war was a great example.

The Green New Deal or whatever repackaged word Trump decides to call it will happen... its inevitable, it will create loads of jobs and give the economy a chance to reboot.
Still preaching the commie bullshit...
HAHAHAHA... And Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny and the tooth Fairy will be put in charge of it all...
What panty waste you are..



Rammer
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2653
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 12:17 pm
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:19 am

ElAcky wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:57 am
Rammer wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:14 am
ElAcky wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 6:49 am
Really glad Dems blocked bailout of Big Oil & Trump hotels....

After this comes the Green New Deal... infrastructure baby !!! to get jobs rolling.
Keep dreaming......

I do agree with you that we already have socialism here to a large degree.

How did America get by during the Spanish Flu of 1917/1918 without a 2 trillion dollar stimulus? Some how we did or they did and by 1920 the economy was roaring.
Why now is it one week out of work and everyone needs a random $1200 check sent to them or they will go bankrupt? Too many Americans are too dependent on government to solve all of their problems. We need govt. here and we need stimulus. But seriously?. I'm good with better unemployment benefits and some kind of extension of health care benefits for out of work people and some targeted relief to save the economy from collapse. But come on, this spending is ridiculous.

Personally, I sold a good percentage of my equities much earlier on and then some more on the recent bumps - I'll get back in when I see companies hiring again.
There is plenty of money to go around... just happens to be in the hands of the greedy 10 to 20 people.

The rest of us are living close to the edge and a soon as there is a down turn we are in trouble. This is fundamentally wrong.

Every time something like this happens there is a fundamental change in behaviour and the role of Government. During and after the war was a great example.



The Green New Deal or whatever repackaged word Trump decides to call it will happen... its inevitable, it will create loads of jobs and give the economy a chance to reboot.

This is pretty much how the world has worked since the beginning of time. Yes there are greedy billionaires holding a lot of wealth. Sometimes you need govt. to even the playing field and reign some of that excess in. But - no, there isn't plenty of money to go around. Take it away from them and redistribute it and we all get poorer. The pie shrinks. You hate capitalism because by it's nature it is uneven in how wealth is distributed. So in theory it's bad. The reality is though that economies based on capitalism have done by far the best job raising living standards for the masses. It rewards hard work, risk and ingenuity better than other systems. It grows the pie and everyone benefits.



User avatar
ElAcky
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2691
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2018 12:49 pm
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:31 am

Rammer wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:19 am
ElAcky wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:57 am
Rammer wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:14 am


Keep dreaming......

I do agree with you that we already have socialism here to a large degree.

How did America get by during the Spanish Flu of 1917/1918 without a 2 trillion dollar stimulus? Some how we did or they did and by 1920 the economy was roaring.
Why now is it one week out of work and everyone needs a random $1200 check sent to them or they will go bankrupt? Too many Americans are too dependent on government to solve all of their problems. We need govt. here and we need stimulus. But seriously?. I'm good with better unemployment benefits and some kind of extension of health care benefits for out of work people and some targeted relief to save the economy from collapse. But come on, this spending is ridiculous.

Personally, I sold a good percentage of my equities much earlier on and then some more on the recent bumps - I'll get back in when I see companies hiring again.
There is plenty of money to go around... just happens to be in the hands of the greedy 10 to 20 people.

The rest of us are living close to the edge and a soon as there is a down turn we are in trouble. This is fundamentally wrong.

Every time something like this happens there is a fundamental change in behaviour and the role of Government. During and after the war was a great example.



The Green New Deal or whatever repackaged word Trump decides to call it will happen... its inevitable, it will create loads of jobs and give the economy a chance to reboot.

This is pretty much how the world has worked since the beginning of time. Yes there are greedy billionaires holding a lot of wealth. Sometimes you need govt. to even the playing field and reign some of that excess in. But - no, there isn't plenty of money to go around. Take it away from them and redistribute it and we all get poorer. The pie shrinks. You hate capitalism because by it's nature it is uneven in how wealth is distributed. So in theory it's bad. The reality is though that economies based on capitalism have done by far the best job raising living standards for the masses. It rewards hard work, risk and ingenuity better than other systems. It grows the pie and everyone benefits.
I Just think capitalism had its time and that time is coming to an end... i recognise that its afforded us a lot of growth..

What I hate is how the greedy corporates take advantage of the poor and how they own government and hence the thoughts and agendas of many (inc lots on this forum).. a great example is those that call it commie scum... what they get from the corporate led media channels.



Rammer
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2653
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 12:17 pm
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:52 am

ElAcky wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:31 am
Rammer wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:19 am
ElAcky wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:57 am


There is plenty of money to go around... just happens to be in the hands of the greedy 10 to 20 people.

The rest of us are living close to the edge and a soon as there is a down turn we are in trouble. This is fundamentally wrong.

Every time something like this happens there is a fundamental change in behaviour and the role of Government. During and after the war was a great example.



The Green New Deal or whatever repackaged word Trump decides to call it will happen... its inevitable, it will create loads of jobs and give the economy a chance to reboot.

This is pretty much how the world has worked since the beginning of time. Yes there are greedy billionaires holding a lot of wealth. Sometimes you need govt. to even the playing field and reign some of that excess in. But - no, there isn't plenty of money to go around. Take it away from them and redistribute it and we all get poorer. The pie shrinks. You hate capitalism because by it's nature it is uneven in how wealth is distributed. So in theory it's bad. The reality is though that economies based on capitalism have done by far the best job raising living standards for the masses. It rewards hard work, risk and ingenuity better than other systems. It grows the pie and everyone benefits.
I Just think capitalism had its time and that time is coming to an end... i recognise that its afforded us a lot of growth..

What I hate is how the greedy corporates take advantage of the poor and how they own government and hence the thoughts and agendas of many (inc lots on this forum).. a great example is those that call it commie scum... what they get from the corporate led media channels.
I know you hate it and I do too. But when it isn't them doing it, it is greedy govt insiders taking our money and then taking care of themselves. They are in these positions of power because they know somebody. They are in these positions of power and they know nothing about how things work, don't produce anything, don't risk anything. So, they are far worse than the billionaires.



User avatar
HellRam
Pro-bowler
Posts: 2841
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2015 10:17 pm
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:47 am

Rammer wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:52 am
ElAcky wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:31 am
Rammer wrote:
Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:19 am



This is pretty much how the world has worked since the beginning of time. Yes there are greedy billionaires holding a lot of wealth. Sometimes you need govt. to even the playing field and reign some of that excess in. But - no, there isn't plenty of money to go around. Take it away from them and redistribute it and we all get poorer. The pie shrinks. You hate capitalism because by it's nature it is uneven in how wealth is distributed. So in theory it's bad. The reality is though that economies based on capitalism have done by far the best job raising living standards for the masses. It rewards hard work, risk and ingenuity better than other systems. It grows the pie and everyone benefits.
I Just think capitalism had its time and that time is coming to an end... i recognise that its afforded us a lot of growth..

What I hate is how the greedy corporates take advantage of the poor and how they own government and hence the thoughts and agendas of many (inc lots on this forum).. a great example is those that call it commie scum... what they get from the corporate led media channels.
I know you hate it and I do too. But when it isn't them doing it, it is greedy govt insiders taking our money and then taking care of themselves. They are in these positions of power because they know somebody. They are in these positions of power and they know nothing about how things work, don't produce anything, don't risk anything. So, they are far worse than the billionaires.
Well said. Socialism doesn't enrich the people, it enriches the government. Thus so many are in favor for it these days.



User avatar
UplandRam
Site Admin
Posts: 1442
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2015 6:19 am
Location: Glendora, CA
Contact:

Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:53 am

This bill also includes billions in loans for Casinos. WFT??



Post Reply
Rate this topic
  • Information
  • Who is online

    Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests